#29 Relational Wealth with Ryan Nelson

When impact meets intention, anything is possible. Even a wealth beyond comprehension...though not the kind you might expect. 

Devin welcomes Ryan Nelson, the family man and entrepreneur behind Circle of 5 Coaching, to the show for a poignant discussion on the value of something far greater than finances: relationships. 

Tune in as they unpack the concept of relational wealth and how to build it, including the importance of authentic connections, honoring tension and the key to cultivating your own all-important inner circle. 

It's a reminder of the richness that is always within reach when we choose to invest in a legacy that endures. Listen now, available wherever you get your podcasts.
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Guest website: https://circleof5coaching.com/
Thompson Tees: https://thompsontee.com/?ref=154&_utm_campaign=affiliate

For the full experience, check us out on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DevinHendersonSpeaker 

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:05

Hey, what's going on everybody? Welcome to the Possibility Mindset Podcast. I'm Devin Henderson, I am your host and I believe that something greater is always possible for you All. Right, ryan, what's going on?

Speaker 2: 0:19

Hey man, it is great to be here, fun to be at Excedra and enjoy their food and their coffee. This has been a blast, isn't it great to be here.

Speaker 1: 0:25

Fun to be at Etcetera and enjoy their food and their coffee. This has been a blast, Isn't it? Great Love it, the food and the atmosphere, and Sonia, our server, and Shannon, the manager. They are so good here at Etcetera. We're grateful that they still have us, you know, giving us this space, feeding us breakfast, this wonderful. You know you're drinking the coffee.

Speaker 1: 0:39

Yeah Right, my guests know I'm 192 days off coffee right now, so it's getting serious finally over the half year point. But yeah, their coffee is stellar. So if you're into that kind of thing which I still am undecided- yeah. We'll see.

Speaker 2: 0:54

I am enjoying it and I remember one time coming here on the 4th of July with my family. We were trying to think where should we go for a good place to eat breakfast and we don't go out to eat a whole bunch?

Speaker 1: 1:08

And we came here and it's just as good now as it was then. So that is so funny. Like people have just like organically endorsed this place. The guests have over and over again, without me prepping them and being like hey, just make sure you say something good. I mean cause Brad Ellis, it's his favorite breakfast spot, he said you know, and other people have mentioned it too, so that's so cool. I'm glad you said that All right.

Speaker 1: 1:25

Well thank you, etcetera, for your sponsorship. We appreciate that. And, by the way, remember to go to YouTube, watch the full experience, check out what's going on. Who knows, I don't know how physical it's going to get that you're going to want to watch it, but I don't know. He may punch, punch me, right, I'm just making up stuff.

Speaker 2: 1:42

Now I don't know how hard hitting this yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:46

Oh, there you go, how hard it is. Well, now you have to punch me, because now they're like oh, let's get to YouTube.

Speaker 1: 1:57

All right, cool, um, so yeah. And then, if you, you know if you are listening on Apple, just give us a five-star review, if that's, if that's what, uh, you're feeling? Yeah, but just leave us a comment, because we do want to extend our reach and give more hope to more people. So there it is. Okay, let's do one product placement. Okay, we're going to talk today about Thompson Tees. We've talked about it before. They are.

Speaker 1: 2:15

You know, if you sweat profusely from your armpits and you feel like you can't wear light colors because it's like like bleeding through and it's embarrassing and you have to keep your arms down, thompson tees are the way to go. Okay, it's been a game changer for me. I wear these on stage and I can wear whatever I want to now Pinks, fuchsias, lime greens, whatever. It's awesome. They were called the best undershirts for men to control armpit sweat. So, spoiler alert, you still sweat, but you're just controlling the fact that people don't know about it, right? So that's what's great. So if you have hyperhidrosis or sweat heavily, you've probably tried everything to stop or conceal that armpit sweat. So this is the answer for you, okay, so all you have to do is go to the affiliate link. We'll put in the show notes, because it's one of those really long ones with a bunch of hash like equal signs and question marks. So, seriously, go to the link, check it out if this is something you deal with. Um, this, this was a game changer for me. I was able to like update my wardrobe with all kinds of fun clothes because of this. So so, thompson, t's check it out. All right, that's that good stuff.

Speaker 1: 3:21

Let's uh let's introduce my friend, friend Ryan Nelson. I am so excited to have you here, and over breakfast we got to kind of catch up a little bit. So this was one of those mornings where I was. I kind of came here like, okay, I'm just showing up to work. I mean, I was excited you were here, but I wasn't really in the zone yet. And then, once you started talking about what your passion is and what's possible in your life, my emotions kind of woke up and I was like I am now got my game face on, ready for podcasting. No kidding, that's the kind of zone you put me in. So that's where we are. So let's introduce our friend Ryan.

Speaker 1: 3:53

All right, when faith and family intersect, anything is possible, even a wealth beyond comprehension, though not the kind you might expect. I'm joined today by Ryan Nelson, my friend, a family man, pastor and entrepreneurial mastermind behind Circle of Five Coaching. In this relational community, members are engaged, equipped and empowered to cultivate richly authentic connections. By leveling up relationships, they invest in their future and get intentional about where and with whom to spend their time, the most valuable resource of all. So here it is, ryan. That's it. This is great man, so I love you know you were talking about emotional and relational wealth, right. That really caught my attention, and what I want to hear about is what's you know in terms of a possibility mindset, what's possible from here forward? But can you catch us up a little bit on, like all of the necessary backstory pieces, so that as we move forward with your story, it all makes sense, and how far back do we need to go?

Speaker 2: 4:59

Yeah, man, I, I love it. So to share this in perspective, you know I'm not going to go all the way back to childhood, but there were pieces in childhood where I was broken and needed to wrestle through some things. But in this journey that I've had, I discovered my own community through being a small business owner and I was part of a networking group and they plugged us into these communities. We called pods and, honestly, not podcasts, but pods.

Speaker 2: 5:30

And honestly, in this community, probably 85% of the pods weren't really connecting, but our pod was really connecting and I was in this pod for about two or three months and then I ended up getting sick in 2021, ended up being in the hospital for 27 days. Life was falling apart.

Speaker 1: 5:51

Let's not glaze over the cake. Is it okay if we just camp out here? On this for a minute, because you shared in much more detail over breakfast about this. Now, first of all, Ryan and I knew each other before today. We actually go way back. We go back to 2010.

Speaker 2: 6:05

I was thinking it was about that time.

Speaker 1: 6:06

Well, and the reason I know the year is because here's how we met. At the time I was part of the Magic Ring of Magicians here in Kansas City. So the International Brotherhood of Magicians Ring 129 is Kansas City's ring, and every year they have a competition, a magic competition. There's two of them there's a close-up contest and then there's a stage contest, and I entered both that year and you were one of the randomly selected. What's it called when it's not with you? Layman, Layman judges, right? So I think there were three judges total Two were magicians, One was a layman. I don't even know how you got selected for that?

Speaker 2: 6:41

How did that happen? So I was in a networking group with Mr Goodhart, one of your members. Oh, alan Goodhart, yeah, yeah, cool, cool and he knew of me and he's like hey, we need someone, Would you consider doing this? And so he invited me to come and I brought my son that night.

Speaker 1: 6:53

You brought Reed. Who was? How old would he have been in 2010?

Speaker 2: 6:56

At that point, he would have been seven years old.

Speaker 1: 6:58

Oh, wow, okay.

Speaker 2: 6:59

Yeah, and that was a turning point for his interest in magic. He started taking up magic and going to the magic shop and stuff Awesome. And yeah, that was a blast and I was like why are they picking me to do this? I don't know anything about magic and I think I was just the one that was easiest to impress in the group. And you did impress me that night, and not only with your trick, but afterwards, um, I read, came up and met you and you bent a. You did the mental bending of the fork, which was extraordinary, and you actually gave that to read.

Speaker 1: 7:32

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 7:32

And he was like testing it, trying to figure out how did he do that stuff and does he still have the fork? I didn't. I'll have to ask him. I know he had it for a long time.

Speaker 1: 7:42

A lot of people keep it for a long time. I was just curious. But that's so cool that just being around that whole magic atmosphere, it just fired him up and gave him a new interest. That's awesome.

Speaker 2: 7:50

Yep, and then our kids ended up playing in the same basketball league a few years later.

Speaker 1: 7:56

And I kept running into you at Upward. That's true.

Speaker 2: 8:00

And then our kids ended up in the same homeschool co-op and stuff like that, and so, yeah, our paths keep connecting.

Speaker 1: 8:08

They do, they do keep connecting and in fact, right now your wife, sarah, is my daughter Eva's teacher. They're just wrapping up first grade. And then Ashton, your daughter, works at the school and, as I was telling you, she's all over the place there, beloved by everyone, and just walks around like she's in charge, not in an arrogant kind of way, but kind of like I know more than anyone else here knows about everything that's going on. So if you have any questions you can ask me. But she comes across with such humility and gentleness at the same time, so it's like a really unique presence in that school. We're so blessed to have her there.

Speaker 2: 8:46

She has been a joy to raise and I'm really proud to be sending her off to school this fall. She's on an adventure that's gonna be amazing.

Speaker 1: 8:53

Yeah, that's awesome. Where's she going, by the way?

Speaker 2: 8:55

She's going to Ozark Christian College.

Speaker 1: 8:56

Oh, yeah, okay.

Speaker 2: 8:57

And she's pursuing teaching and getting a Bible degree as well, and she's thinking about middle school teaching and getting a Bible degree as well, and she's thinking about middle school teaching middle school.

Speaker 1: 9:06

She is brave yeah, she just has a heart for the shapeability of that age group. Wow, that's so great. And then Reed, the 10-year-old we were talking about. He's on his way out of college.

Speaker 2: 9:17

Yeah, he's got one semester left and he's going to be a middle school youth pastor.

Speaker 1: 9:21

What's it with this middle school thing?

Speaker 2: 9:27

Your family is just a bunch of brave people, man.

Speaker 1: 9:28

It's the way our church structures service.

Speaker 2: 9:29

High schoolers get to be coaches for middle school and our kids just have fallen in love with that stage.

Speaker 1: 9:31

That's so great. That's great. And then we don't want to overlook Landis, who is. How old is he now?

Speaker 2: 9:36

He is 15, and he's passionate about disc golf. He's currently working three jobs to try to uh support his disc golf habit, habit huh, you called it a passion at breakfast. Now it's a habit. And um, and then we've got a uh, 12 year old, uh, bennett, who's coming along, who is just a um, he's a social butterfly. Wherever he can connect, he will, and creativity, and also a passion for disc golf and awesome.

Speaker 1: 10:08

So it's fun to be a dad. He's in sixth grade, right?

Speaker 2: 10:10

yeah, he and my daughter camber, you're in the same class, so that's great getting ready to head into that seventh grade level and stuff and it's wild to see that.

Speaker 1: 10:19

But that's wild. Well, that's, it's good to get the end. And I was telling you, your wife sarah, just such a great, just such a calming presence, like what, what we need there. You know, your family just brings just this essence of calm I think that was like the one word I would use to describe you all just a good, healthy, contagious calm.

Speaker 2: 10:35

So well, you know and that brings me and I know we need to get back to the hospital story at some point, but I want to just talk about that is there have been. One of the things that I get really passionate about is we talk about financial wealth and stuff like that, but there's so many other types of wealth that exist and relational wealth is one of those and that's really kind of my niche, that's my passion, and for a number of years our families created some choices where we're choosing to invest in that relational health over investing in the financial health side of things. And that's a really key part of my story is I dealt with guilt over not being as successful as I should be as a business owner, and I worked in nonprofits for a number of years and didn't make a lot of money and didn't have a lot of access to invest in retirement and all those things that go along with it. But as we look back through our story, the reality is that our future we've invested in a legacy through relationships, as opposed to try to collect as much money as we can so we can hand money down. And that's really been part of my journey is just to realize that while I was in the hospital, I needed relationships to help me get through that.

Speaker 2: 11:51

While I was in a dad, I needed to invest in those relationships because my greatest contribution to this world is really my kids and what they're going to offer and what they're doing. And so my wife and I have really prioritized that and we've made some sacrifices for it. But I wouldn't trade it for the world, because it's just been in the last couple of years even more so in the last few months, that I've realized how wealthy I am, even though it may not be in the measure that's as easy as a bank account or stuff like that. But when I look at who I have around me, I'm just realizing, man, I am blessed and this is going to carry me for a long, long time.

Speaker 1: 12:35

Yeah, I mean just hearing you explain that. It explains a lot about your family and how you all are, the way you are and why you're so relational. Because I mean, like you mentioned, we kept crossing paths over the years and every time I would see you it was always like hey, you took the time to come over, go out of your way, say hi, spend some time talking to me, whether it's in the hallway at the school place or, you know, at Upward at a game. And so many times we're hurried in life and how many times are you at a meeting or church or wherever and you just pass someone? They don't even look at you, right, it's someone you know and you're kind of okay, you know and just don't take the time. But you clearly I mean relational wealth. That is to me, that's your brand, that is what you are all about.

Speaker 2: 13:16

So absolutely, and I think that the season in the hospital was really the catalyst to get me there. Just, I was in isolation. It was dealing with COVID, so nobody could come in and see me and even the medical staff would only come in so often because every time they came in they had to be all robed up and it was a big process to come in and see me. And just in the isolation of that space, the highlight of my day was a nurse coming in and squeezing my foot to check my temperature and blood flow and stuff like that, and that was the closest thing to connection and and to affection that I felt. It wasn't affectionate but it wasn't poking with needles or or the blood pressure cuff clamping on your arm and just really the two things that I came out of my 27 day at the hospital with 27 days, four weeks, which you were supposed to help me out with some kind of I was trying to do virtual presentations.

Speaker 1: 14:17

You were going to come on and be part of my beta testing. And you're like I'm not feeling well, I can't do it. Next thing we know Ryan's in the hospital going through four weeks of it.

Speaker 2: 14:25

Yeah, and part of the challenge of that that was after my son's senior year, before he was leaving to college. So, we missed our last family vacation before he was going off to college. We missed a lot of those memories and so, all of a sudden, everyone on the floor, the staff was, like, focused on we got to get him home before his son leaves. And he left on a Friday and I got home on Monday, so I, like, had three full days home with him before he left to college.

Speaker 2: 14:55

But you know, in that season, the, you know there's a blessing in those curses, and the blessing I experienced there is I learned two things. When you can't do anything else, you find out a lot about what matters. And the two things that really mattered to me is I needed to be a teacher. Every time something new would happen, a new staff member would come on and I'd say, hey, here's what's happening and here's how this is working for me, and stuff like that.

Speaker 1: 15:20

You're educating the staff as a patient, basically. As to my story?

Speaker 2: 15:24

yeah, and advocating for myself. But, Even when I couldn't do anything else, I had to just share what I did know. And then the other piece is I was an encourager Just by nature.

Speaker 2: 15:36

I encourage. Hey, doctor, thank you for helping me. Man person delivering my food. Thank you so much. That makes a big difference. I really appreciate you and I couldn't stop doing those two things finding a way to teach and finding a way to encourage. And that's when I started thinking wait, is this small business that I'm a part of, which was a home inspection company? Is that my future? Because even when I couldn't do anything else, I still had to do those things, and so I had my inner circle of relationships, my circle of five, and those guys were there for me, and one of the people in that group she actually brought up a few months ago. The reason I knew that I wanted to be in the group with Ryan was when he showed up at one of our weekly online meetings from his hospital bed. She's like I want to be with that guy for a long time to come. And here we are, three plus years later, and that group is still thriving, and it's been amazing.

Speaker 1: 16:34

Yeah. So the crazy thing to think about is in society, in life, you know, I think about that squeeze on the foot was a highlight of your day. I think a lot of us are just living, going through life relationally, with just the squeeze on the foot, thinking that's enough, not really investing in daily relationships and while that you know it can keep you alive, but it's not going to keep you living right If all you're getting is that squeeze in the foot. We need so much more than that right, which is what I'm excited to hear more about and the teacher, the encourager part, is huge of it. I'm really curious how you created that inner circle. How do you choose the five people and how do you filter people out who maybe want to be in the group or maybe you're tempted to invite in? How does that work?

Speaker 2: 17:17

Yeah, those are great questions and I think the key here is starting with the fact that it's going to look different for each person, and you've got to cultivate a community around you that is pursuing the same things that you're trying to pursue. So I talk about the four types of relationships. There's proximity, that's the people you run into at the store, your cashier that you see every day, your server at the restaurant, the other parents at the ball game. You see them, but really the question being asked there is where are you? All we have in common is where we are, and that's what I call proximity. And then the next level is connection, and at that level the question is how are you? We're starting to connect and we all need that sense of being known and knowing someone else, and so you start getting that at this connection level, and you've got to be intentional about asking questions and following up and creating systems where you consistently check in with each other.

Speaker 2: 18:16

For some of you, it's going to be a text every day. For some it's going to be hey, I'm too busy for a small talk, we're just going to meet once a week or a couple times a month or whatever. But you set a rhythm where we check in with each other just to say, hey, how are you doing? Last time you told me this was going on in your family, is everything okay? And then the next layer in we get into an accountability level where we start asking more specific questions on what are you becoming, and so it might be work-related. Hey, I need to make sure I do 20 sales calls a week. Okay, how'd you do on your goal?

Speaker 2: 18:51

And now I get to ask specifically about the things that you've told me. You want help, and that's that what conversation. And then you get into that inner circle. I call that the transformation level and that's the who are you? And that who question. All gloves are off. At that point, this might be the point I hit you. That who question is about. You told me your goal was this, but I'm going to ask about this because I feel like there's some incontinuity here. So you said you wanted to be a better dad, but it sounds like you worked 75 hours last week. How's your fatherhood going? Because now it's not just the what questions that you give me permission to ask, it's the whole life picture, and so we all need a level of connection, a level at that connection level or deeper. But if you have someone who's looking at that transformation level, they want that and then their inner circle has someone who just wants that, how are you level inner circle as someone who just wants?

Speaker 2: 19:55

that how are you level, that conversation becomes filled with friction because the connection level person they just want to laugh together, they just want to check in with you. But this person's like so how's your marriage, How's your Bible study, How's your this, that and the other thing? And it's like way invasive for that person. And so those relationships end up blowing up over time because they have different expectations. That's why a lot of small groups in churches don't work. That's why a lot of times when businesses try to cultivate, hey, we're going to create social groups within your department or across departments, a lot of times they don't work. Because they come into those networking experiences with different expectations and so it might start with a bang but then it fizzles because they're not having the same hope.

Speaker 1: 20:41

Yeah, so so the four levels now are proximity, and the second one was connection, and then accountability and transformation.

Speaker 1: 20:49

So at some point you have to get to the point where you're having a conversation about what the relationship is. When's that? Is it accountability? Is that where it's like hey, what are we like? Let's define the relate, because if you start holding someone accountable to something or asking about who are you, what's your deeper why, it's kind of like Whoa, like I haven't really let you in, so you have to have an agreement. I'm guessing right. What's that look like?

Speaker 2: 21:12

You're right, and that's. It's interesting. You ask that because that's the moment at which I started realizing I need to go all in. I was telling my inner circle you know what running this company man it's? We're basically rebuilding. While I was in the hospital, our revenue dropped 49% over the previous year. And then my two guys that were working for me because volume was down, they got side hustles and because I hired such amazing people, those side hustles were like, hey, would you consider working for us full time? And so I went from, at one point, having three inspectors and an admin plus myself, to being a one-man shop again, plus myself, to being a one man shop again.

Speaker 2: 21:55

And it was like this moment of okay, are you going to rebuild this from the ground up, or are you going to pour yourself into something else, or are you going to go get a job and just get a steady paycheck? Because that entrepreneur grind, it's a grind. And I started processing this with my inner circle and they kind of said I told them hey, I'm going to do some job interviews this week. They were like two of them called me up that day and said you need to become a coach. I'm like, no, no, no. Then the second one called up you need to become a coach. I'm like, why are they saying this? I had to relook at it.

Speaker 2: 22:27

But the compelling thing about your question is that we had a guy in our inner circle who was very clear that man, I just want to show up and talk about the industry and talk about what's happening.

Speaker 2: 22:42

And we had to invite him to leave because we were trying to go further.

Speaker 2: 22:49

And I describe it like a rubber band. Your inner circle is that rubber band thing and if someone's holding back here and four of you are trying to move forward, you can only go as far as that band will stretch before the community is going to break. And in that aha moment for me it wasn't that we were firing this person from our group, it was that we were saying you need something different and we need something different and we want to set you free to pursue that so that we can be set free to do this. And it wasn't this big ugly dramatic thing. It was kind of clear that, hey, we have different expectations and so we kind of had to let someone go from our inner circle and, ironically, at the same time we'd already been working to add to our community and it was just a really interesting process and that brought a lot of clarity on why it matters, because most of us just accept who we're given and very few of us actually curate the people that we let into that inner circle.

Speaker 1: 23:59

How did that person deal with the you know letting, inviting them to leave. I like your wording there. We're inviting you to get out of here. Here's your invitation to get lost hit the road.

Speaker 2: 24:09

I think there was a. I mean there was definitely some hurt because that was part of the routine Sure, but I think there was also some freedom, because he wasn't comfortable in our group anymore, because we were going to those deeper level of questions and he was showing up less and less. For that I would say that that person is still a friend of mine. We still check in with each other from time to time. So it wasn't a divorce Sure, it was just a parting of hey, we're on different tracks, let's not keep fighting to keep in the same mode, because neither of us are going to be content in that. And that's when it became real clear we need to give people permission to say you are looking for connection and that is perfectly fine, but I'm looking for this transformational level of relationship and I need to realize that I'm going a different direction.

Speaker 1: 24:58

Sure.

Speaker 2: 24:58

And I think that it was really healthy the way we navigated it. Yeah, and again, that's when I started realizing more people need to be equipped for this.

Speaker 1: 25:08

Yeah, okay. So then give us a quick sort of like tutorial on how do we build our inner circle. What's the right number of people, how close in proximity should they be, or can they live anywhere in the world? And what's that invite look like? How do you set expectations?

Speaker 2: 25:23

How do you the Circle of Five Network, which is a membership group of people that are pursuing, and there's three different levels based on your intensity, and those are all things that we're talking about there, and so first of all, let's talk about where the concept comes from. It's attributed to Jim Rohn, although no one actually has him on record saying it. He was just quoted in one of those Chicken Soup for the Souls books or something like that.

Speaker 2: 25:56

But he said you are the average of the five people you spend the most time with and if you really want to read a great story to help illustrate this, there's a book called Tribe of Millionaires and they really talk a lot about this developing your inner circle concept in that book. It's more of a story that has teaching points in it. It's an easy short read. I highly recommend it.

Speaker 1: 26:24

Tribe of Millionaires.

Speaker 2: 26:25

Tribe of Millionaires and in it they start talking about hey, look at your people, what do you think the average income of all the people in your group are? And he's like, oh, that's my average income too. And what's the health rate of all the people in your closest five people? Oh, that's kind of I'm overweight, like them too. Or I'm I'm fit, like they are too. We kind of realize we start looking like those people that we spend the time with. What's the morning routine of the five people you spend the most time with? Oh, it looks very similar. Well, is that good or is that bad?

Speaker 2: 26:54

So I think, first of all, as you're curating who that is, you've got to start looking for people who are aspiring to things that you respect. You've got to look for people who are what I would call persons of peace, that when you approach them, they receive you and they engage you and you're you're able to connect with them easily and they share information there and they open their network of relationships to you. Hey, it's funny, you mentioned that I know someone. Can I connect you with that guy? And it's not just business networking, it's I want to invest in you, I want to, I want to help you, I want to invest in you, I want to, I want to help you, I want to serve you, and so I think you're looking for those people that are building their lives in a trajectory that you're building your life. They might be ahead of you in some areas. You might be ahead of them in other areas, but you're creating a conversation where you can invest mutually in each other and you can move forward together.

Speaker 1: 27:51

Okay, yeah, that's interesting because you know it's. I think it'd be so easy to get caught up on wanting to really experience like wealth as we think of in terms of finances, like I want this group to really boost my business, because I mean, a lot of times you do want that, you do want peers who are doing similar things to you so that you can grow and learn from each other. A lot of times we call it like mastermind groups. So do we need multiple groups then, for the multiple facets of our lives? You?

Speaker 1: 28:17

know, is that possible? How does that work?

Speaker 2: 28:20

Yeah, and that's that's problematic for me. To man. How many? How many things do we need in our lives? Right, the truth is, if you're with a group of healthy people pursuing full lives, that group becomes your board of advisors, they become your coach, they become the people that help you, and one of the things for me, this is driven in part by mental health. We are in a mental health crisis in our country. The Surgeon General has declared that there is a loneliness epidemic in our country. Well, that's not a good epidemic. We know epidemics are never good to be dealing with, but that's a real crisis and the ability to turn the tide. I don't think the government's going to offer the solution for how to overcome loneliness.

Speaker 1: 29:05

And this podcast just done, got political.

Speaker 2: 29:09

And I'll just say this it doesn't matter if it's a Republican administration or Democrat administration or anything in between Government doesn't build healthier relationships in your home. That's not their function.

Speaker 2: 29:22

And so we've got to grab control of that and we've got to take ownership for that ourselves. And so the importance of this conversation is that if you have a circle of people around you and they start seeing you withdrawing because it's the early signs of depression, they're asking you hey, what's going on? Why are you pulling away? Because these people know you, they know how you behave on a given day and they can draw you back in before it becomes a spiral out of control. You quit your job, you're isolating from your family and things are falling apart because you've got this inner circle. So this inner circle is people that know you, they know what you're pursuing, they know who you're becoming and they get to invest in all of those areas.

Speaker 2: 30:12

And my goal isn't to create people that are reliant on me for coaching. My goal is to help create people so that they can, as soon as possible, have a built-in coaching network in their relationships. It doesn't mean that they don't occasionally need to reconnect for a series of something that they're trying to overcome, whether it's in their group or in their career or family. We can still reconnect for coaching, but I don't want people to sign up for a 12-month contract just so that I can get a check yeah.

Speaker 2: 30:40

The goal is build a community around you that can help you build your whole life. So you've got to curate who those people are to move your life forward.

Speaker 1: 30:48

Okay okay, does that answer? It does absolutely. I have like a thousand questions I feel like right now, so before we go on with the question the Circle of Five movement is that what it's called?

Speaker 2: 30:58

Circle of Five Network.

Speaker 1: 30:58

Circle of Five Network. Is this something that's readily available to people who want to join something like this, or is it still in creation, or where are we with that?

Speaker 2: 31:06

This is the beauty of where this podcast rests in the conversation is that this is a brand new launch. In fact, I did a soft launch not long ago and it failed miserably. And in the past that mindset thing would be like oh, maybe this isn't what's needed, maybe whatever. And what I began to realize because I started getting some feedback, particularly from my inner circle, my circle of five what I realized is my messaging was wrong.

Speaker 1: 31:36

Okay.

Speaker 2: 31:37

From years of working in the nonprofit space. I was a pastor for a lot of years. Yeah, I was almost appealing to people as though would you help me by becoming a member to this group.

Speaker 2: 31:46

Okay, I was almost appealing like this was a charity effort, right, and we were using the word subscription when really what it was was a charity effort. And um, and we were using the word subscription when really what it was was a membership, um, and they're like, hey, what's my value? And why are you charging so little money? I know other groups that are 500 bucks a month for this type of thing. Why are you doing this? And so the, the launch, the soft launch, that was a fail, was actually catalytic because it brought great clarity. And so we are in the early launches of this. But there's there's three levels to it, and that, that earliest level, it's like 10 bucks a month. The point of that level is to help people who are just looking for that connection level to be known. How are you? And then the next level of investment is going to be more of that accountability level.

Speaker 2: 32:34

So, how do you get to that level of really building a community of accountability? And then the top level, that transformation level. How do you have that authentic community where you're building that, because you don't just jump into transformation? You got to build your network. You got to build trust through each of these steps. You got to build your network. You got to build trust through each of these steps. You got to make sure, hey, do I feel safe telling you how I am? Um, do I feel safe telling you the information I want you to hold me accountable for? And then do I really feel space letting you go outside the boundaries of that information and moving into? Hey, you're welcome to ask me whatever question you need to ask if you see a blind spot, and so just guiding people through those hard conversations and helping them to manage their expectations along the way.

Speaker 1: 33:21

Okay, Well, you use that word, failure with the soft launch, which to me is a beautiful word, we think like, oh, it didn't work. Well, I don't see it like that, and I know you don't either, and my audience is when I'm giving keynote presentations. It's riddled with examples of failure. On my you know my part, like with SOC, with my America's Got Talent story, Failure just means you're really trying something you know and, of course, we're going to learn from it. Michael Jordan said I failed over and over and over again in my life and that is why I succeed.

Speaker 2: 34:16

So it's just beautiful that you've gone out and taken that step, people, that when, when you're defaulting to old ways of thinking okay that they're championing you to keep driving, to keep going, to keep succeeding, and that's so important.

Speaker 2: 34:30

I my son, was recently in a disc golf tournament. With like seven holes left, he was down by five strokes and um, and disc golf has become a passion of mine. I haven't had a hobby for years and I discovered disc golf and it's something I love. But I just told him hey, listen, you're way behind. The guy behind you is behind you by two strokes. You just play your game and if the guy in front of you makes some mistakes and you make progress, then exploit that, but don't try to win the tournament right now.

Speaker 2: 35:00

Just play your game. Well, I think we need people like that in our lives, that when we fall behind, they're the people that remind us stay with your plan, stay with your game, adjust what you can, but don't go after something you didn't come prepared to go after. And that's what the inner, that's what a healthy inner circle circle does, because they're on the same journey you're on. They're wanting the same things you're wanting, even if it's in a different industry or, um, a different pursuit. In their personal life. They're on the journey of trying to improve their life and champion the best life that they can have.

Speaker 1: 35:35

Yeah, that's great. So after that initial launch, did your group, your inner circle, how did they encourage you in that same way to keep you in the right mental space to keep going?

Speaker 2: 35:44

Well, first of all, they kept saying, dude, there's a change in how you're thinking. And they kept reminding me of my own growth, even though it's not showing up in the business. And again, that's where I start realizing man, I am rich. I am rich in relationship. The three and a half years of investment in this inner circle community is paying off now, because in the past I might've given up, I might've been like, well, that didn't work, let's move on to something else. But they helped me to realize and it's showing up in other places in my life. I was for my daughter's graduation party. I was building this deck coming off of our deck, so that people could come down the other side.

Speaker 1: 36:26

A temporary one?

Speaker 2: 36:27

No, like a platform leading down to stairs so that we could go off both sides of our deck. Okay, all right. Never built anything like that before.

Speaker 1: 36:35

This was a journey.

Speaker 2: 36:37

And I was cutting the stringers, which are the pieces that the stairs sit on going down.

Speaker 1: 36:41

We all know what stringers are.

Speaker 2: 36:43

Come on.

Speaker 1: 36:44

No dude, I don't build anything, Okay.

Speaker 2: 36:46

So I was cutting the stringers and my wife came out and I said I'm trying to remind myself that I don't suck at cutting stringers, I'm new at cutting stringers and she's like whoa, that's a different mindset, because she could see all right that I was fighting to not let that voice in my head take over something that I'd never done before, and she championed that for me to say.

Speaker 2: 37:12

I see that change. That would not have happened if I hadn't surrounded myself with people who are challenging my. And. Ed Milet talks about resetting the thermostat. I don't know if you've heard that or not, but he talks about we all have the default the thermostat returns back to 72 degrees. So every time our life starts heating up, man, things are going well. I'm at 75 degrees, I made it to 78 degrees, I'm pushing 85 degrees. We often just have that reset. That feels like man imposter syndrome. They're going to discover me, it's all going to fall apart and we start self-sabotaging and we cool the thermostat back to 72.

Speaker 2: 37:50

My thermostat would be set at 72 if it weren't for the fact that I had a cheering section that I meet with virtually every week my inner circle. There's a guy from North Dakota, a gal from North Carolina, two guys from Florida and one from Cincinnati. So that's my inner circle and we meet every Wednesday morning online for about an hour and 15 minutes.

Speaker 1: 38:18

And when you meet with those people I mean, then things like a mindset shift becomes habitual, because when you have someone constantly speaking truth to you that way, then you start speaking lovingly to yourself right and it's not always great, because my guy, chris, in that group, chris, played college football.

Speaker 2: 38:35

He was a firefighter running a successful inspection company. We go on an annual retreat together where we all get face-to-face and we go into a deep dive and we share whatever. Two years ago we just went deep in our personal story in the background and we all poured out our stories and just to give us understanding of where we're coming from. And in one of those conversations Chris started pushing on me and Chris and I got into a back and forth that was raising voices and saying but you're not listening to me and I mean we were getting, we were getting, we were getting fired up. It's not all warm fuzzies, because we realize what's at stake. We challenge each other and we push each other to realize you're settling. And Chris was basically saying to me you're settling for something I don't think you should be settling for and I don't think you like it either.

Speaker 2: 39:28

I mean he was calling me out and we went back and forth for several minutes, and so this isn't about.

Speaker 1: 39:37

So the boxing glove thing is like legit the punch thing might be coming here. It's your voice, you're getting passionate, you're getting loud. I like this. I feel like I'm ready for a good slug and hey, welcome back. So much for being seamless with this. Our camera overheated, so we're jumping back in. So I'm just going to go back to where I think we were, because I know I had a question about. You were talking about conflict. So in a group like this, how do you get to the point where you're able to give permission for conflict?

Speaker 2: 40:05

Yeah, you know, relationships have to go through a maturing cycle and so jumping into transformational relationship is tough. You've got to build trust to get to that point. So your relationships have to start with how are you? And then go through the what are you, the how are you? Questions that may be for weeks, it could be for months, but you got to see, hey, how does this respond to hard times? How does this person respond to good times? How does this person engage with what's actually happening in their life?

Speaker 2: 40:43

And then when you start holding accountability, one another to accountability, then you see and one of the reasons five people to me is important is when I've done accountability with one other person or two other people, if I'm struggling, I'm not going to ask the hard questions because I don't want the questions coming back to me. And so when you're in a community of just one or two people or other people, you tend not to hold people accountable to the level, especially if you're not all driven at a very high level, which most of us aren't. Those type A personalities hardcore, get it done, mark it off the list, move on. So we need to make sure that we've got enough people that someone's willing to ask those accountability questions. But to get to the point of conflict, it's this conversation of trust. How am I building trust?

Speaker 2: 41:32

Throughout this journey, this person has proven they cared about me. As we've gone through the how are you stage, this person has shown up consistently when they've been asking what are you becoming? And I'm asking them what are they becoming? And there's this back and forth dialogue and then we get to this transformation stage who are you becoming? Forth dialogue, and then we get to this transformation stage who are you becoming? Chris was so passionate about me building the life he sees I have the potential to be. He couldn't shut up anymore. So Chris had to pour into that out of that trust that we built up. I didn't like it and it made the other three people sitting in the room pretty uncomfortable at that moment because it's like what do we do? They're yelling.

Speaker 2: 42:14

This is awkward and I just had to say, chris, let's ask someone else's take, and someone else spoke into it who'd been on the whole journey with us.

Speaker 1: 42:24

Right.

Speaker 2: 42:25

And that person was able to say well, this is what I see has happened.

Speaker 1: 42:29

Okay.

Speaker 2: 42:30

And they've spoken into it. So that community conversation. If you've got five people who built trust with each other and one sees a conflict, you have those other three people that can offer some perspective on. Here's what we're seeing. We're going to validate the concern or we're going to. We're going to object to that concern and we may not all agree, but we've developed enough love and trust in the relationships we have with each other that we're moving forward.

Speaker 1: 42:59

Wow, that that's awesome. I, I, I feel that I've been in a situation recently where there was like a uh, it wasn't as it wasn't a five people, but there was at least an extra party or two involved that could speak truth and give some perspective. So I can see the value in that. And this is just like amplified when you have the group of five, you know, with people who have been on the entire journey, and the trust is built. And I know that you know, in my marriage I have conflict, but those that's what bring us to the next, to the transformation level, and bring us even closer. So, really, conflict for healthy relationships at the transformational level. It Really conflict for healthy relationships at the transformational level. It's necessary, right, it has to happen.

Speaker 2: 43:33

Well, any area that we want growth in, we have to go through struggle for it to move forward, whether it's building more muscle, you've got to hurt on Tuesday after you lift on Monday, which I don't have a lot of experience in, but that's how they tell me it works.

Speaker 2: 43:49

But we've got to go through struggle to be able to grow. And I think in your business you've got to go through the grind in order to get the payout. In your relationships you got to go through the conflict in order to enjoy the fruit of that relationship. And I mean, even if you go back to creation, the seed has got to die, it's got to break open before something can flourish out of it. And I think relationships require that breaking open in order for stuff to grow.

Speaker 1: 44:17

Yeah, man, that's great. So I'm so many questions about how this works and we don't have time for it to answer all my questions today, but what the possibilities for you. You know what, what are you excited about for you in this and where this is going, and what's your vision for it? Like, what gets you up right now and makes you go, man, you know, is it this whole the inner circle network or what is it? What else is possible, as we like to ask here?

Speaker 2: 44:44

Yeah, so the inner circle, the circle of five network is what we call it. That's really where I'm pouring my energy in to, because I just believe we need it. On my, on my vulnerable days, I dream of what if we had a million people that were a part of this network, which which sounds absurd to even say right now, because we're still trying to get our, we're still trying to launch which it should sound.

Speaker 1: 45:08

I'm all about seemingly impossible goals, because if you know you, you can achieve it. It ain't big enough, right? And what if? What if I don't hit a million?

Speaker 2: 45:14

people. And what if I only hit 120,000 people? Man, only 120,000 people built a network of relationship around them. Yeah, that's a win.

Speaker 2: 45:24

And so that's really where my passion is is to pour into people, and I like to be an innovator. I used to think that that was a curse. I had someone very close to me one time say I am jealous at how entrepreneurial you are, because I need more security than that, and this is an entrepreneurial effort. I mean, it's scary to launch into this, but I have such deep conviction and that we need this because we are in a crisis in our culture and so, really, the the being intentional about at least even if even if you can't afford to be in this transformational level of coaching that we offer, if, if your desire is just to be known for $10 a month, you can be a part of this community. Get some reminders, get a prompt on a regular basis on here's questions to ask your inner circle, just to keep a dialogue going. We're trying to create value that you can use on a regular basis, and so, really, where this is going is man, what if, by the end of the year, we had 500 people to be a part of this community? And I've got goals of where I'd like to be and what's different?

Speaker 2: 46:40

I read a book by Darren Hardy called the Entrepreneurial Rollercoaster, and in it he was meeting with his friend. They got together and he started talking about our number as well, our subscription for this, magazines are up to this and that, and I got this house and that and his friends like why are you talking to me about this? You don't even keep your own checkbook, you don't care about money. And his friend helped him realize that his passion was to impact people. And that was huge for me, because now I'm thinking, not how do I make this much money, but how do I impact this many lives? And so I get to pursue having impact and not make it about dollars and cents at this point.

Speaker 2: 47:24

And that's really set me free to be able to pour into. I mean, there's, the logistics of things cost money to do, but to be able to just go after investing in people and helping them to figure out how to thrive together and helping them to realize that they don't have to hire a coach every month for the rest of their life, they can build a network of people where they're reciprocating that investment in each other. That's what fires me up.

Speaker 1: 47:48

I love it, and what you were saying actually reminds me of the last episode of the podcast with Lauren Schieffer Salute to Significance. She talks about her father. The colonel told her if you are significant, you will be successful. You know significance before success and that's exactly what you're saying. Like let's make that impact, let's reach just however many people we're meant to reach and success follows in the way that it's supposed to. So I love that. Focus on relational wealth before financial wealth. It kind of feels the same way If you're healthy, relationally, things are just going to follow Well before we talk about how they can connect with you and keep up to date on the I've tried to say it like three or four times the circle of five network. Did I finally get it right?

Speaker 2: 48:27

You nailed it, that's it.

Speaker 1: 48:28

Okay, boom by the end, I got it I keep wanting to say inner but Circle of Five Network. Before we talk about how you can follow that, one of the things you talked about was you didn't call it this, but it's like an upper limit problem. I just read the Big Leap by Gay Hendricks and you talk about how we get. The thermostat is set at 72, and things start to heat up 85 and we're like we start to sabotage ourself and it manifests itself in weird ways and illnesses and injuries, and he calls it an upper limit problem. Like we don't think we deserve that next level of greatness and so we even if it's a relationship you know we start to like, start an argument to bring things back down to 72. Is that what I'm saying? Like that's not good to come back down, or you want to keep heating things up, right?

Speaker 2: 49:10

We literally self-sabotage we. We do it to ourselves because we don't feel like we're we're deserving, we don't feel like we can sustain it, we don't feel like man. I don't know if I can start a relationship again, or I don't know if I can, um, start up this business again, and we start doubting our capacity to achieve. And so we, we all of a sudden turn it back down and that's, I go back to my thing. That's why we need people to say yeah you're doing it again.

Speaker 1: 49:42

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 49:43

And I the I can't tell you how many times the people in my circle of five can't tell you how many times they've said you're going back into that mode again wow, yeah and they're calling me out of it because I'm I have to reprogram the software sure, and I keep I keep uninstalling the new software and installing the old software because it's so ingrained in my natural behaviors and it doesn't just change in a few months.

Speaker 2: 50:10

It can sometimes come back years later and I've got to. When I was going through therapy after being in the hospital, I had to trust my therapist. When I was walking down the hallway gasping for air, he was watching my vitals, he was watching my signs and he was telling me you can go 10 more feet. And when I think back to the goal of trying to walk 10 feet it's like how was it that primitive in my life.

Speaker 2: 50:39

And I needed to trust the person who was looking at the other signs to make sure that I was going to be safe, so I had to rely on his assessment, not mine. That's the same thing with this inner circle. Those people are watching the signs in my life and they're telling me this is where I'm at and they're championing for me that I can go further than I think I can.

Speaker 1: 51:03

Yeah, that's so great. That's so great. Thanks for being here.

Speaker 2: 51:05

It's been great. I love this. Thank you.

Speaker 1: 51:07

I want the listeners to be able to like find this when it's ready to go and like maybe even follow you on your journey, or whatever that looks like. What's the best way for them to follow you, to kind of keep in touch with the Circle of Five Network at this point?

Speaker 2: 51:29

So our website, circleoffivecoachingcom slash network would be where you can learn more about the Circle of Five Network. And then LinkedIn is another place that I'm fairly invested in, and you can find me at the username would be Circle of Five on LinkedIn. So yeah, connect with me. I'd love to connect with you, learn your story and continue to invest in this relationship.

Speaker 1: 51:50

Awesome. What else is possible, right?

Speaker 2: 51:52

What else Great things ahead.

Speaker 1: 51:54

That's right, man, awesome. Well, hey, just as we wrap and I do have one final question for you, but just want to say thanks again to Excedera Shawnee for allowing us this space Also want to give a shout out. I meant to do this at the top and I breezed over things too quickly. My new podcast producer, ashley Stare, is a dream.

Speaker 2: 52:12

Man, she made this process easy for me.

Speaker 1: 52:14

I'm telling you, a few weeks ago I didn't have her yet when I had Jesse read on and we talked about who, not how, and how you find your who's and I found her like just after that, and I'm telling you that, like the work that it has taken off my plate that someone else can do more efficiently and more effectively has been such a value. So, ashley, thank you so much for making my process so much smoother and freeing up more time for my family. So, thank you, appreciate that. Hey, also, don't forget about Thompson Tees. Go to the notes, click on it.

Speaker 1: 52:44

I'm telling you, if you're a sweaty armpit person, like some people I know, point at myself it's going to change your life. So check that out, okay, watch on YouTube. If you're listening, you know, give us that review comments and let us, you know, listen. If you're seeing a clip on social media, let us know. How has this inspired you, you know, to maybe start building your inner circle even right now and start thinking about who those people that you'll reach out to once you have the tools and resources through the Circle of Five network to actually take action on that, okay. So last question I have for you, ryan could you just give me, as an experienced father, just one piece of advice for my daughters.

Speaker 1: 53:25

One piece of advice for your daughters A little on the spot here.

Speaker 2: 53:28

For you or for your daughters.

Speaker 1: 53:30

For them, for them because I'm perfect, I don't need. I don't need any work whatsoever you know what I'll say this?

Speaker 2: 53:37

um, as parent-child relationships go, there's a natural tendency for conflict to develop over time. And I always liken it to the idea of a bow and arrow that we as parents are the bow and our kids are the arrow. And if there's not tension in that relationship, when we let go of the arrow it falls off and it stays home. So, as you're, you're aiming your kids. While there's not tension, that's that's the zero. Through eight, nine, 10 years old.

Speaker 2: 54:10

You're aiming those kids, but as those kids end into those teenage years, that bow you're starting to put tension on that and now you're just fine tuning it because their trajectory is set. And that tension, kids, that you're feeling with your parents, that's a natural thing to happen. And there's going to come a point where they're going to release you and you're going to launch and we pray as parents that you hit the target. And so I guess I would just tell kids that that tension isn't dysfunctional. It doesn't mean go off the end and be a jerk and be obnoxious, but it means don't feel like that's your relationship falling apart. That's actually preparing both mom and dad and you for that launch, so that you can go into the world and accomplish what you're set out to do.

Speaker 1: 54:56

Wow, you just blew my mind, man. That is such a good analogy and that should be a TED Talk, if it's not already. That's so good, Because you know we all feel that. I mean I feel that tension in all of our relationships at times you know, but wow, that's so good.

Speaker 1: 55:09

Thank you for that, man. I'm going to share that with my wife. That's going to be helpful for us, thank you. So okay, we're going to say goodbye with our favorite question that you ask when you embrace a possibility mindset, which is what else is possible? So I'll say what else you say is possible and we'll sign out. Are you ready? Let's do it Okay. Let's do it Okay. Thanks for joining us and remember to never stop asking the question what else?

Speaker 2: 55:30

is possible.

Speaker 1: 55:31

See you next time.